"It Doesn't Matter."
"It doesn't matter", is what Steve Oats, lawyer for Capstone Development, said this evening, after the Planning and Zoning Commission denied permission for the proposed Capstone II development in Freetown. Two people in the audience clearly heard this remark. What Oats meant by this is for anyone to guess. However, it is likely not anything as honorable as would have been said by the famous Captain Oats, of the Scott Antarctic expedition. A likely interpretation is that Capstone believes that it has the City Parish Council 'in the bag', so the recommendations of the Planning and Zoning Commission are ultimately irrelevant.
The meeting today was quite predictable. The developers made their pitch. The real estate speculators, who stand to make a fortune on the Capstone deal, opined pompously on their interpretation of property owners rights (including a ridiculous invocation of the U.S. Constitution). Perhaps more interesting was the presentation by Glenn Armentor who actually attempted to deal with some of the objections that residents have raised. However, his presentation was spoiled by some factual errors.
Although there were only a few Freetown residents who spoke, they pointed out the errors in the presentations of the Capstone fans. This included an explanation of why the 'property owner's rights' arguments rested upon a logical confusion (this is explained in the posting 'So-Called Reasoning', below). It was clear that Capstone II is as unwelcome in Freetown as Capstone I, though.
The Planning and Zoning Commissioners asked many deep and penetrating questions, especially of the Capstone and their supporters. Fred Prejean had Capstone's Kent Campbell positively squirming when he asked him how far they would be prepared to go to support residents. Campbell was in a bind, as he had tried to portray Capstone as actually being friendly to the residents, without actually offering any concrete promises. This was pretty funny. The most interesting series of questions though were the ones that concerned the secret meeting at which the $200,000 'Impact Fee' from Capstone had been negotiated. Glenn Armentor admitted to being present, along with a Mr. Edwards representing Capstone. Councilor Bruce Conque also volunteered that he had been present too. When Armentor was asked who else had been there, he felt unable to supply any further information, on the grounds that he had not been given permission to do so. What was finally admitted however, was that there were no actual residents of the Freetown neighborhood present at this meeting. Isn't there something very ironic here? The terms and conditions of the initial Capstone development were negotiated behind closed doors, by a developer, an attorney and a Councilman, none of whom actually currently live in Freetown, plus persons unknown, while residents were excluded. Draw your own conclusions.
When it came time for the Commissioners to vote, there was a little bit of confusion, due to the wording of the motion, but this was rapidly sorted out. Initially, it appeared that Capstone had prevailed, but once the confusion was resolved, they had lost. This was the context in which Mr. Oats made his remark.
So now the whole circus will almost certainly return to the City Parish Council. If Mr. Oats and his friends are correct, then after much pantomime, the Council will vote for the developers. It is clear that the Planning and Zoning Commission have read the relevant law concerning the role of the Commission (La. R.S. 33:101, passim). The Commission has also demonstrated courage and concern for the residents of Freetown. Thus far, the City Parish Council has shown no such understanding of the State statues, nor concern for the wishes of residents, nor any spine. Thus, the question is, will any Council members (other than the three previous dissenting votes) show spine and listen to the people of Lafayette, or will they instead be swayed by whatever they were promised at their private meetings with Capstone? This is a simple case of out of State developers and their real estate agent friends, verses the all the other residents of Lafayette. How the councilors vote will tell the people of Lafayette what their local representatives really stand for and where they place their priorities.
The meeting today was quite predictable. The developers made their pitch. The real estate speculators, who stand to make a fortune on the Capstone deal, opined pompously on their interpretation of property owners rights (including a ridiculous invocation of the U.S. Constitution). Perhaps more interesting was the presentation by Glenn Armentor who actually attempted to deal with some of the objections that residents have raised. However, his presentation was spoiled by some factual errors.
Although there were only a few Freetown residents who spoke, they pointed out the errors in the presentations of the Capstone fans. This included an explanation of why the 'property owner's rights' arguments rested upon a logical confusion (this is explained in the posting 'So-Called Reasoning', below). It was clear that Capstone II is as unwelcome in Freetown as Capstone I, though.
The Planning and Zoning Commissioners asked many deep and penetrating questions, especially of the Capstone and their supporters. Fred Prejean had Capstone's Kent Campbell positively squirming when he asked him how far they would be prepared to go to support residents. Campbell was in a bind, as he had tried to portray Capstone as actually being friendly to the residents, without actually offering any concrete promises. This was pretty funny. The most interesting series of questions though were the ones that concerned the secret meeting at which the $200,000 'Impact Fee' from Capstone had been negotiated. Glenn Armentor admitted to being present, along with a Mr. Edwards representing Capstone. Councilor Bruce Conque also volunteered that he had been present too. When Armentor was asked who else had been there, he felt unable to supply any further information, on the grounds that he had not been given permission to do so. What was finally admitted however, was that there were no actual residents of the Freetown neighborhood present at this meeting. Isn't there something very ironic here? The terms and conditions of the initial Capstone development were negotiated behind closed doors, by a developer, an attorney and a Councilman, none of whom actually currently live in Freetown, plus persons unknown, while residents were excluded. Draw your own conclusions.
When it came time for the Commissioners to vote, there was a little bit of confusion, due to the wording of the motion, but this was rapidly sorted out. Initially, it appeared that Capstone had prevailed, but once the confusion was resolved, they had lost. This was the context in which Mr. Oats made his remark.
So now the whole circus will almost certainly return to the City Parish Council. If Mr. Oats and his friends are correct, then after much pantomime, the Council will vote for the developers. It is clear that the Planning and Zoning Commission have read the relevant law concerning the role of the Commission (La. R.S. 33:101, passim). The Commission has also demonstrated courage and concern for the residents of Freetown. Thus far, the City Parish Council has shown no such understanding of the State statues, nor concern for the wishes of residents, nor any spine. Thus, the question is, will any Council members (other than the three previous dissenting votes) show spine and listen to the people of Lafayette, or will they instead be swayed by whatever they were promised at their private meetings with Capstone? This is a simple case of out of State developers and their real estate agent friends, verses the all the other residents of Lafayette. How the councilors vote will tell the people of Lafayette what their local representatives really stand for and where they place their priorities.
posted by Save Freetown at 8:51 PM
26 Comments:
Hey, this posted twice--you could delete the second one.
"It doesn't matter": I heard Oats say it!!!
Just because you can build an eyesore on your property, does not mean that you should. Just because there is the right to private property in this country, does not mean it trumps other rights, values, or priorities.
Extreme individualism + private property DOES NOT equal democracy.
see you at the city council :)
When Armentor says that if it isn't this complex, it will be a pipe yard, he assumes that the putative pipe yard will *have* to go in.
No Ms. Bray, he assumes that the LINC will never come up with the money to buy the property from the landowners, and at some point the city council will have to give in and let one of the proposed developments occur on this property. And he is right
Anonymous said:
he assumes that the LINC will never come up with the money to buy the property from the landowners...
Yes, that is what he said. But he assumes (and asserted) that the Capstone development is about the best that can be done for the neighborhood, which is where he and I disagree. I'd wait for a better proposal. (Apartment complexes are eco-hazards too!)
I talked to the city employee in charge of their demolition about why they didn't tear down more of these abandoned crack houses and his response was that it was too much of a psychological blow to the residents of the neighborhood. He went on to talk about how properties hold histories and to change too much in such a short time is damaging to the health of the neighborhood.
That is really interesting!!! I guess the city has changed its mind???
One of my big concerns is that this neighborhood could turn into the type of student ghetto that some beautiful old neighborhoods in Columbus, OH have become. If too many apartment complexes go in, and too many old houses are sold to absentee landlords who rent them to transient tenants (such as students) and don't keep them up, it creates a ghetto with no owners who really care, or residents with a long-term commitment.
One of the things I really like about the Freetown area is that it actually has a culture. I haven't liked the tone the pro-Capstone people have taken in this regard. They intimate that we should be grateful someone like Capstone is coming in ... as though it were a charity!
I don't live in Freetown now. I had aimed to buy there, trading in my 1940 Saints Street area house for an 1890 one in Freetown. Now that these projects are going in, I am less convinced. I would have been *much* happier with public housing in single family dwellings, as per the complex on Moss St. These two and three story megabuildings are really out of place.
Sadly, there aren't many vacant lots left in freetown.......If there were I would buy them and develop them into dense,compressed,multi-family dwellings, much like the capstone project only smaller. Similar say to the 4 new condo style multi-family dwellings going into the 800 block of Stevenson St. (part of the LINC #7 neighborhood) Of which , I have heard nothing derogatory from this group...how hypocritical. I am quite sure they will be bought by someone for student housing....you know the drunken, orgiastic, kids that pay Berkley and Bary's salaries. But of course my arguments are way to logical.
Now that I have recovered, I too want to preserve freetown. But, in my opinion, the way to preserve freetown is to define its boundaries. Whatever they are,and get some recognition. Form a freetown committee and ask the city for a special designation. You know what, it's not worth the paper it is written on. But, it brings awareness to the community that is POSITIVE. The kind of awareness that has come out of this "save freetown" group is very negative. And, I am speaking about the city not the neighborhood. Hell, why do you think the council voted the way they did....you think it was the $200,000, get a life. The council oversees a budget in the $100's of millions of dollars. $200,000 does not even blow their skirt up. No, the reason 6 council members overturned this decision is because they listened to their constiuents. That is no different from Louis Benjamin. A majority of his constiuents wanted him to oppose it , he did. Back to the point. Positive awareness for freetown. Armentor is a major proponent of freetown. Get Armentor to have the state representative and state senator for this area to pass a proclamation that freetown is a wonderful old place with history, or something to that effect. Again , not worth the paper. But, positive awareness. Start the process to make this a recognized historical district. The way it is being done now is wrong.
"you know the drunken, orgiastic, kids that pay Berkley and Bary's salaries"
Anonymous, the person who sounds negative, and who is illogical, is you. And the students do not pay faculty salaries. (Where do you get your information? Do you understand how university and state budgets work?
I don't understand why you think anyone talking here is interested in a meaningless proclamation. I have heard that Armentor wants a monument, gates, etc., but I have not suggested such things. A modest plaque could be interesting, and designation as a historical district would be good for various reasons, but I'm not really interested in the sort of proclamation and fanfare you
seem to suggest.
Yes Ms. Bray , I understand how universities work and state budgets, which I doubt seriously that you have any clue about. If you did have a clue then you would know that without students, there would not be a need for professors. Last time I checked you are an Adjunct professor at ULL? If so then you teach students and these students PAY for the privilege of you teaching them.....although for god's sake, I have no idea why! And, reasoning would say , that if these students pay to learn under you or other professors, then again they PAY YOUR SALARY.
It seems that 'Anonymous' should be renamed 'obnoxious'. There are three free lots on Main St., two on Vermilion and at least two on Convent. Thus, as per usual, anonymous shows profound ignorance.
Dr. Bary is actually tenured faculty, so that is another error.
Steps are being taken over historical designation. A neighborhood organization already exists. So, anonymous is behind the times.
However, the problem with the Capstone development, as compared to other apartments is the size. A 4 unit develoment is one thing. A 400 bed development is quite another.
Mr. Benjamin voted with his constituents. However, the turncoat Chris 'graffiti boy' Williams voted against the will of most of his constituents.
As for faculty salaries, funding based on student numbers is only a small part of a complex formula. Clearly, anonymous has not heard about the importance of research, nor the role of grant funding.
Thus, by spreading and speaking error, anonymous once again shows the ill-educated nature of the fans of Capstone. Sad.
well professor zero, i am relatively certain of this - the magnitude of grants you & your co-workers are generating in the philosophy dept. are not paying YOUR salary (or the salary of anyone else in your dept. for that matter).
when was the last time you were the principal investigator on a research project that brought in hundreds of thousands of dollars for the university? i would guess the answer to that would be - NEVER!
CAREFUL - you shouldn't bit the hand that feeds you!! you might end up hungry.
Despite the worthless rhetoric you repeatedly spew - unquestionably, without students, there would be no need for professors like you!
but, i digress. back to the point. while freetown does have historical importance and signifigance, its residents do not have the money to fund the LINC program, nor does the city as a whole. It will never happen.
Capstone's development will be a welcomed improvement to a neighborhood that badly needs an infusion of money and residential development rather than industrial tenants. And, Mr. Armentor was correct, Capstone's development alot better than a pipe yard or some other sort of industrial tenant, which is exactly what you would have been stuck with if Capstone hadn't come along.
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Yes Ms. Bray , I understand how universities work and state budgets, which I doubt seriously that you have any clue about. If you did have a clue then you would know that without students, there would not be a need for professors. Last time I checked you are an Adjunct professor at ULL? If so then you teach students and these students PAY for the privilege of you teaching them.....although for god's sake, I have no idea why! And, reasoning would say , that if these students pay to learn under you or other professors, then again they PAY YOUR SALARY.
This, however, does not show that you know anything about these issues. You also appear to be unaware of my correct title and of the spelling of my name. Who are you anyway, and why are you not brave enough to show your own face?
Are you trying, in your later comment, to suggest that Capstone is bringing hundreds of thousands of dollars to the university? I'm P.I. on a project that's bringing in just under 100K to the university right now. And that's with a tiny team and tiny overhead.
Are you trying to say that Capstone is bringing in money to the *university* now, or what?
And anyway: why is it that you are now attacking commenters, rather than discussing the issue at hand?
And finally, there is a question I have been dying to ask: if Capstone-like projects are so great, why are they not being put in fancier parts of town?
Yes Ms. Bray, I understand how universities work and state budgets, which I doubt seriously that you have any clue about. If you did have a clue then you would know that without students, there would not be a need for professors. Last time I checked you are an Adjunct professor at ULL? If so then you teach students and these students PAY for the privilege of you teaching them.....although for god's sake, I have no idea why! And, reasoning would say , that if these students pay to learn under you or other professors, then again they PAY YOUR SALARY.
This sophomoric comment, however, does not show that you know anything at all about these issues. You also appear to be unaware of my correct title and of the spelling of my name. Who are you anyway, and why are you not brave enough to show your own face?
Are you trying, in your later comment, to suggest that Capstone is bringing hundreds of thousands of dollars to the university? I'm P.I. on a project that's bringing in just under 100K to the university right now. And that's with a tiny team and tiny overhead.
Capstone is not doing nearly so well per man, and they are making money for themselves which is an entirely different thing.
And anyway: why is it that you are now attacking commenters, rather than discussing the issue at hand?
And finally, there is a question I have been dying to ask: if Capstone-like projects are so great, why are they not being put in fancier parts of town?
Just so you know , there are more than 1 anonymous posters on this site. However, it appears that anonymous 2 has it right, as well. Ms. Bray, I am attacking your comments in the same spirit that you and Berkley have continuously attacked mine. My identity , in due time. You confuse the work you and other ULL professors due as what "drives" the university! But just think about this , Do you honestly think that the doors of ULL would remain open if there were not students to attend classes? The answer is no! So, while I am sure your work is important it is not sufficient in itself to keep the doors of ULL open! you should never forget, what allows 2 crackpots like you and Berkley to exist are the STUDENTS.
Oh, and to answer your question of why if capstone like projects are so great why are they not being put in fancier parts of town. Ms. Bary are you denegrating the Freetown neighborhood with this statement? Wow, I think you are saying that the freetown neighborhood is not Fancy. Ms Bary, I know after your comments last monday night that you live in the Saints Street area, but please don't stick your nose up in the air. After all this is an historic neighborhood and worth fighting for.
The real answer is need, proximity to the univerity and price of land. That is why it is this location ....regardless of whether you think it is a fancy part of town or not.
Oh, Berkley, my statment was "Sadly there aren't many vacant lots left in freetown..." Now , I know that I am not nearly as smart as you , Berkley. But, you gave the example of 7 lots and where they are located. And you said ," as usual, anonymous shows profound ignorance". I guess you want the average blogger to see that you showed me up, that there are vacant lots available. Well Berkley , my comment was "there aren't MANY vacant lots" I never said there weren't ANY vacant lots. So Berkley , why do use falsehoods to prove your point? Hmmmm!
Freetown people/site creators, I would suggest a post about focus and etiquette here. I only don't suggest comment moderation because I don't think you want to control the conversation in that way. Perhaps you could disable anonymous comments, so that the different anons could each take their own alias, if they don't want to show their identities. That way, it would be easier to see which voice was saying what.
It would be advantageous if this turned back into a conversation on the issues at hand, rather than a flame war on whether Istvan, or I, or this Professor Zero (who I am pretty sure can't be Istvan) are or are not supportive of students, are or are not responsible professionals , and so on.
Anonymous, I never said I wasn't interested in the students. It is for management companies/large property owners, not faculty, that students are a direct source of income. Nor have I said anything derogatory about Freetown. The developers' people have, although they have toned that down considerably.
Anyway, I have already stated my position in several ways, several times, in several venues. To recap:
1. I do not favor the construction of large Metairie-style apartment complexes in this area. Four-plexes and such, I wouldn't mind.
2. One of the problems I see with a large influx of people is traffic. I doubt that, even with the best of intententions, residents will end up walking to campus regularly. It would be very helpful if some sort of shuttle bus or van service were provide, particularly in bad weather and at night.
I would like see this space used to discuss concrete solutions to concrete problems. I would suggest leaving this thread here--it's been
beaten to death.
I realize this comment thread has gotten a little ridiculous, but I do have one question.
If Anonymous (or one of them) is the owner of the property on which Capstone I is to be built: would he have wanted to go ahead with this sale if it had been possible to realize the development project started earlier (moving nice old houses onto the property and renting them)?
It was a nice project. It's too bad it was abandoned. I'd be curious to know why: did the owner just run out of money, or was there some obstacle from the city?
Greetings from New Orleans! :-)
Catherine, on your post, I can be reached through Ish--or I'll talk to you when I see you, we have met before. I'd be less cagey here, but I don't want to deal with the kind of abuse from anonymous people Leslie Bary has had to.
Let me speak candidly and frankly about all of the comments back to Leslie Bary and Professor Berkley. I am the original Anonymous, you can follow me through the archived months. The reason I have become critical and challenging of both of these individuals is because if you go back as recent as Professor Berkleys blog above you will see that the both of them have been challenging and derogatory to me first. The gloves are off! However, if Berkley can tone down the rhetoric and stop the insults , then yes, we can re-establish some decorum. And no I do not own the land where the old homes are professor zero. Like you I have often wondered why they brought them in and never completed the project. I know they are trying to get rid of them now. FYI. Ms. Bary , I will call a truce , but you are hypocritcal when you suggest no more comment moderation , when in fact your doing this exact thing to my comments has driven me to put yours down. I will not site examples here , and I suggest in light of a truce , you do not force me to do so. I am in the process of purchasing property in the LINC area and maybe in freetown to build "smaller" condensed, compressed housing for students and are young professionals. And for years, my friends know that I have characterized what is happening to the area as "economic segregation" not my goal , rather only an observation of an old established neighborhood , becoming more and more "in play" real estate wise. And ,since orighinally there were a majority of residents who were African American , hence my term. Please, do not try and mischaracterize my comments, they are simply an observation. Quite the contrary, I feel very compassionate for the displaced residents of this community. I just don't know how to stop it. As they say , change is inevitable.
Congratulations on good work, Save Freetown! I don't live there but it looks to me as though the $200,000 and a new neighborhood organization is a victory, given the odds. I hope you get to use them well. This would really help the city retain its individuality, build its neighborhoods, and so on.
Anonymous, you have my name: if you have a personal issue with me, look me up in the phone book and give me a call! If I've hurt your feelings, I am sorry. But you are the one who attacked me as a professional and called me a 'crackpot', and you don't even say who you are!
I have no special power. I am just a citizen who said my piece in an open meeting, and who talks with some friends & neighbors on this blog.
In other words: chill! I have made my views pretty clear, and I don't want to take up too much of this space repeating them. It's up to people who actually live in Freetown, etc., to think about what they want to do.
"...Anonymous, that is not a very good characterization of Freetown. See my comment on "Capstone and Facts", above.
Are you just afraid of Black people, perhaps, Anon...?"
"...But you are the one who attacked me as a professional and called me a 'crackpot', and you don't even say who you are!"
Ms. Bary,
The first quote is your very first response to my very first Blog in May '06. In it you question whether I am afraid of black people perhaps. I challenge you to defend this question you ask from any of the comments I made in the blog you made this response to. The answer is , you can't defend it. The reason you can't defend it is, there is nothing in that particular blog to suggest anything about the people in Freetown, or there ethnic background. So, your response comment is abitrary and inflammatory. So, in your latest blog you say that I attacked you by calling you a crackpot. Well, sweetie it looks like you attacked me back in May, way before my recent responses to your blogs. Ms. Bary , please get your facts straight.
Well, sweetie it looks like you attacked me back in May, way before my recent responses to your blogs. Ms. Bary , please get your facts straight.
Anonymous: I am not your sweetie, for one, and I am Dr. Bary or Professor Bary in professional contexts, for another. I do not know who you are, but some of those in favor of the development made some really racist comments, back at the very first meeting, about Freetown homeowners who didn't have a lot of money, but didn't want to sell out. So I really really do wonder to what extent the attitude to the community of the developers and some of their support personnel, especially back at the beginning, was racially motivated at least in part.
You have gotten facts wrong about me, and made assumptions, and I am a public person who can be checked out, and you can call me on the phone if you'd like, and we can talk. All I did to you, was ask an anonymous person a question.
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